Reenita Das is an industry expert with over 25 years of healthcare marketing and consulting experience, which include engaging with global clients and start-ups to develop and implement growth strategies. Reenita currently serves as Transformational Health Partner and Senior Vice President and is the first woman Partner at Frost & Sullivan. In addition, she is the Founder of the Corporate GLOW (Growth and Innovation of Women) program.

In this podcast episode, Patty sits down with Reenita Das to talk about all things FemTech, women’s health research, the inequality between men’s and women’s health, and how to make significant progress in funding the women’s health sector.

Key Takeaways:

• The importance of FemTech and the focus on women’s health
• The lack of funding for FemTech companies
• Most research is done on male subjects or cells
• More focus is needed on menopause and chronic diseases
• How to make a change in the future of women’s health

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Read the full transcript here:

0:00:00.3 S1: This is the Persevere Podcast where we help founders create awesome products and not run out of money. Hi, I'm Patty Post, founder and CEO of Checkable Health. I started the Persevere Podcast because I experienced loneliness and solitude as a solopreneur. I had no one to turn to, and I couldn't find relevant content for high tech entrepreneurs, specifically in the stage of business that I was in. So like any true entrepreneur, I decided to go out and create it. Today, my guest is Reenita Das, she is a partner at Frost and Sullivan, and she has dedicated over 30 years of her career to researching the topic of women's health. She's coined the phrase “She Economy”, and she wants everyone to know that women's health products are not just a niche. We actually are half of the economy, we have more buying power than men. We make more healthcare decisions, and we have our anatomy that should be studied on our anatomy. She really talks about a lot of different things that we don't think about as the everyday consumer, but when it comes to research, things like the model that you're using in mice should be a female if your product is going to be for a female.

0:01:27.6 S1: Most of our medical products are only studied on the male anatomy, and that has been done for decades now, and the tide is changing, but she really talks about how even today that the dosing amounts are on a male adult body, not on a female adult body. Males and females, we metabolize drugs differently, so therefore, should we be having the same dosing schedule as males? Really interesting things out of this podcast, we think you're going to really have your eyes opened to the lack of opportunities that have been presented to women's health, the huge amount of opportunities that there are for innovation, also the changes of how we think about the phases that a woman goes through. For example, menopause, we haven't studied it enough, we don't have enough information out there to accurately understand or predict what is going to happen to our bodies because it's not talked about, it’s not researched. We end up talking to our girlfriends and that's how we get our information, our medical information, rather than going to the source. Reenita, thank you so much for your dedication to women's health, and not just in the US, but globally. She is definitely changing the health care for women, not just for today, but for generations to come. Really excited for you to take a listen, learn some things about women's health and really get active, and if you are an investor, invest in those female founders, those med tech opportunities that are in women's health. So without further ado, let's get into it with Reenita Das. 

0:03:12.2 S1: Welcome to The Persevere Podcast, powered by Checkable Medical, and hosted by Patty Post, a female founder, entrepreneur, wife and mother of three, doing all of the things. The strength to persevere in business is powered by passion, grit and hard work. The Persevere Podcast is for entrepreneurs and business leaders who set out to innovate and change the world with their ideas, whether it's fund­raising your start-up, product development, marketing, branding, or scaling your existing business, this podcast is for you. We'll discuss everything it takes to persevere and build the business you've always dreamed of. Let's make it happen.

0:04:10 S1: Hello everyone, this is Patty Post, your host of The Persevere Podcast. Our guest today is Reenita Das. Reenita is a partner at Frost and Sullivan, and her focus is on women's health and transformation of healthcare, she’s super passionate about changing this healthcare landscape as I am too. Thank you so much for joining me today. 

0:04:34 Thank you so much Patty.

0:04:35 You are welcome. There's a couple of things I wanna say about Reenita. Reenita is the first woman partner after 25 partners at Frost and Sullivan, she is the senior vice president, and she is the founder of GLOW and GLOW is Growth and Innovation of Women Program.

0:04:53.8 S1: And she's also on the board of a non-profit called High Tech High Heels, Silicon Valley, and it focuses on increasing gender diversity in STEM, and in the current role at Frost and Sullivan, she works on futuristic scenarios and forecasts in understanding how healthcare will operate 10 years from today, and working with clients specifically to help them change and how they will impact the trends and how they will change healthcare specifically in women, and she focuses on rethinking consumer business models as healthcare makes a transformation to health and identifying opportunities with companies outside of healthcare, to bring solutions to the health care sector. I'm so proud of the opportunity to meet with you, Reenita, this is gonna be a great conversation. Our pre-recording connection, we already got into some good stuff. So with that, let's get into it.

0:05:54.8 S1: So Reenita, what is your work in history and research, specifically in FemTech? 

0:06:00 S2: I have been working in women's health for almost two and half decades now. I really wanna say that we really never had any women's health till only a few years ago, and even there we’re still on the edge. We're working in a system of healthcare that has been built by men for men, and we've never really taken a step back to really understand how women look at healthcare, what their needs are, how different those needs are to men, and how we want to consume healthcare, how we wanna be able to see our doctors when we wanna see it. All of this is not here to us, and a lot of my work today is really in helping companies understand how different the system of care would be for women compared to men. I've always been a very curious person, I always wanted to find a solution to big problems, and really finding my passion in women in healthcare was really an active… I wanted to always work in the space of human life and I came into consulting and advisory just by chance, simply because it looked very interesting, and eventually spent 25 years in this space, and I’ve had some amazing experiences working in almost 25 different markets, living in 10 countries, working with different cultures, emerging markets. Taken right now, I'm in Dubai, working in the Middle East, looking at the status of women here, so I really...

0:07:42.5 S2: I have a lot of gratitude for the place that I reached right now in my career.

0:07:47.5 S1: It's amazing. Tell us about some of the things that you are uncovering in healthcare in terms of women in our lack of, just our lack of opportunity, you mentioned before the call just about FDA, so can you share with us that story, I think that's a great starting point of exposing that, really we don't have representation in healthcare.

0:08:11.6 S2: So it's very interesting when you start looking at medical devices and pharmaceutical products. We have 50% of the population by 2030. Women will make that 4.2 billion in the world of 8.3 humans, and yet still six years ago, the FDA did not even have a department or a separate office looking at women's specific products. So we did a lot of lobbying and championing work, and now they have an amazing department, we have been working with them for the last few years, we developed an entire blueprint, we want the areas and opportunities that the FDA really needs to focus on, and based on that, they have really crosstracked many new medical devices in terms of incontinence, pelvic health, some of the contraceptives, and I hope many more will come to the fight in the future.

0:09:12.4 S1: Are you seeing that the big Fortune 50 medical device companies, are they growing out their women's health divisions or acquiring companies to have more of a focus?

0:09:26.2 S2: I think the reality is most of the innovation in women's health is coming from the startup culture from women themselves that are founding companies. 80% of the FemTech… technology companies today are run by women, founded by women, and these are all small companies. The large mainstream healthcare companies have had women’s health divisions, but really looking at it in a very traditional way. So now when I find a lot of is that many of these companies are wanting to learn what's happening outside, they wanna learn what are some of the digital products… how they can integrate some of these digital technologies into their current area of focus in terms of their disease area, so they are starting to begin to look at that. For example, one of the big questions that I look at is I study a lot of work in cancer, and if you look at the whole aspect of diagnosis of cancer, this in the United States, it's always very traditional… in hospitals or in clinics, but now there's a lot of focus on women-centered healthcare facilities which are only women that are more catered to the needs of women…

0:10:42.4 S2: And a holistic basis, where… one part of it, but there's a lot of other mind, body and soul kind of products and solutions available there. So now, most recently, some of the Fortune 1000 companies are starting to wake up and say, “You know what? Maybe we need to look at these centers because our products…selling them into these centers, so I think it's happening, but it's still very, very slow and not at the pace that we would like it to be.

0:11:12.5 S1: How about research? Do you think research is happening at the pace that you want it to be happening?

0:11:16.7 S2: Well, if you just look at digital health spending, and this is where the money is, in digital health last year in 2021, was 29 billion dollars spent into digital health funding. And guess what was the funding coming out for FemTech or female technology? It was roughly 5% of that 29 billion dollars, so very, very small. And so we still continue to be a step… less than 5% of the entire funding available, so that continues to be, even though we’ve grown, we’ve tripled in the last two years in terms of amount of funding, FemTech companies, we have one company that's got it to a… so all of that is happening, but it's very nice.

0:12:05.9 S1: And that's surprising considering one of the top downloaded and utilized apps is Clue. It's my favorite app, it just sounds so weird when I first download it, and I was telling everyone about it, it seems so weird, and then I'm like, “Well, why would it be weird when I'm telling my friends, we all have, you assume you all have a cycle, and if you don't have a cycle then or it's intermittent, then you should be tracking it. These tools are amazing, and the access of these tools should be in the app store and we should be creating them, whether it's postpartum or whether it's, you're trying to get pregnant. Now, looking at something that I have joked about, and you probably know Dr. Somi Javaid with HerHealth MD, she was one of our guests and absolutely, just in so much awe of her and what she is going for in terms of research. We talked about the dollars spent on men's health versus women's health, and being from medical devices, the number of dollars that have been spent on the prostate versus the entire female body, can you talk more about that?

0:13:18.9 S2: In my mind, it starts with the whole aspect of the mice. In clinical research in the lab. I don't know if everyone's aware of it, but most of clinical research, clinical research in the lab, when we work with animals or cells taken from the body of animals is male. So we start with a proposition that 90% of the work that this stuff is going to go to, when it becomes finished is to men. So the discussion needs to start from there, why are we not using female mice? Not clinical trials. They're not pre-clinical trials. We start with the mice. So I think that the dialogue needs to go to the mice.

0:13:58.2 S1: And is it the same in pre-clinical research when you move to other animal models? Is it mainly male?

0:14:03.8 S2: Absolutely, so I’ll give you an example of, I don't know if you know the story of Ambien, the sleeping aid, but after 21 years of Ambien being in the market, 21 years it was in the market, and then the FDA suddenly realized that women were having serious accidents the day after using Ambien. And they decided to cut the tablet in half. This was 21 years after it was on the market. The original trials for Ambien was 100% male, there was not a single female on that trial. So I think the basis of all this inequity lies in the simple fact that we start the trial or we start the… with male mice and we use cells from male animals, but why aren’t we using both genders in our scientific research. So when it starts from there, then it's too difficult to get women into a trial when the people... already on male mice. Another big example I have is a product to treat female sexual dysfunction, which is the product called Addyi. This was a product that was in the market for women, and it was found that women were taking the drug with alcohol and those women were having serious side effects. So after it being in the market for a couple of years, the FDA said that they wanted to do another trial with...

0:15:31.1 S2: Looking at the side effects of alcohol on the drug. And the clinical trial was designed, and the study enrolled 23 men and 2 women. 

0:15:39 S1: What?

0:15:40 S2: That's a population of 92% men for a drug intended only for women. Women metabolize alcohol very differently to men, and so there's a huge impact. I have been talking about the vaccination that all of us have gone through. We are getting exactly the same dose of vaccination as our male counterparts. Have we not studied the impact of that on our bodies as we metabolize or hormone effects? None of that has been done. And all of us are vaccinated for the same dose. I do have good news. The good news is… trials now coming in, and we're gonna see many, much more of it and then COVID has really been a catalyst to get that going. I think we will be able to have much better health equity in terms of reaching out to Blacks, Hispanics, women in minority positions to be able to run women only trials because all this time, that was the biggest challenge. We couldn't get enough women or they didn't… so it was not possible, but now with virtualization, I think all the excuses have been cut, so I do think that we can see much more of a higher percentage of women being represented.

0:16:56.4 S2: Good.

0:16:57.1 S1: And it's shown that men will be fast to enroll in the trial, but then they won't go through the follow-on for the complete the trial for the two years, and it ends up being very problematic for these long-term studies, and that inclusion is important, especially in clinical research. We're doing a lot of marketing with our clinical trial, and I have to say it's the most fascinating piece of the trial for me personally, because how you reach people is so important, and we're now doing a translation into Spanish, which for a startup is challenging but it's so important because our population needs devices that are right for them, and if they're not able to read the instructions, why would they, they're not gonna benefit from it. And we want everyone to benefit from an at-home strep test specifically. But even our other products and women's health that we're bringing out, having them translated in Spanish as well, and that brings me to the piece of telehealth. You mentioned telehealth for clinical research, but what do you see as the opportunity for telehealth to help with women's health specifically and broadening that reach?

0:18:20.7 S2: I think it's huge. I think it's huge. They will get better access. It's easier, women have very busy lives than to take care of their work, their home, their child. I think it will be able to fit in. We have found through our research that women don’t make their appointments as much as men do, they don't take their medicine as much as men do, so I do think that with telehealth apps with constant reminders with messaging, instant messaging, we're really going to move to a model of healthcare, which is gonna be much more personalized, it's gonna be much more patient-centric, obviously it's gonna be ambulatory, the virtual…central care, and it's gonna be much more based on data or technology, transparent and seamless. So I think we're moving into a future of healthcare world, which is all, fits in with the needs of where women would like to see their health care going. We just need to have many more products that meet the needs of women, because a lot of the times today, all our work and effort is focused on the early stage of life, a woman’s life, which is fertility, menstruation, pregnancy, and they're not putting in a lot of effort into the whole area of menopause, chronic diseases, which...

0:19:38.0 S2: Which is 1 in 4 women are going to be over the age of 40 years in the US and the world. So 25% of the female population is going to be over that age, and would be much more help in products that are available right now. So we really have to change the dialogue and move it out of just the infertility market, or the menstruation market, and move it to the menopause and chronic disease market in studying. For example, brain health. We haven’t studied the female brain. How is that different from a male brain? People just started studying that. Alzeimers, dementia, it’s much more… when compared to men. But yet, we're only beginning to understand what that important, what those implications are, and menopause is a huge impact on all of these diseases in the future. Talking about the gaps in the education system, I did a study looking at, I think 200 medical schools across the world and looking at how many hours or how many months of people going for studying about menopause and it's really sad. It's less than three months. And this is one thing…population that has this disease. It’s less than three months. So then what, if there is no one who really can talk to you about this or help you about this, then who do you go to?

0:21:02.3 S1: Right, and the education, not being there, like for a startup, we're looking at launching a product, a vaginal pH test, and there aren’t any out there, and something that we have to overcome is how do we educate and thinking of menopause, it's like my mom, she still doesn't really talk about her menopause. She jokes about it now because she's 81, but it's not something I'm talking to my daughter about, she's 11 about getting her period and what's gonna happen with her body. I really have no idea what's gonna be happening to me, I'm 42, and it's almost like a taboo topic too. I remember sitting at a meeting and a woman was like, “Oh my gosh, I'm so hot”, and I was like, “Oh, she's going through a hot flash” and she left and being 28, like what's going on with her? Why is she doing that? And it should be normalized, but we don't talk about those things, so how do companies like ours and others that are breaching the FemTech topic, we are up against the taboo topics that men don't want to talk about because it is uncomfortable, and then we're trying to get research dollars from them, and they're the ones that write the checks or make the decisions, and they're going to then subject themselves to being a part of uncomfortable conversations, and it just feels like it's a losing battle, and how do you inspire people like us that are trying to make a change?

0:22:38.8 S2: Just keep talking about it. That's all I say, get on to all the big conferences and talk about menopause, not about infertility. I know infertility is a big problem, and it's also a big commercial dollar value for the healthcare industry, but menopause is equal, because the impact of meopause leads to so many other diseases. Auto-immune diseases, Alzeimers, dementia, could go into cancer, could go into chronic inflammation, which would lead to other diseases, so the list is endless. Endless, osteoporosis. And if you bring up a really good point, how do we learn about menopause? You don't really learn, once we start having these symptoms, we start discovering, oh my God, what is happening to me, and I do a Google search and I try to get as much help as I want or I talk to a girlfriend that I know who might have had it and that's the way we get information. 

0:23:34 S1: Right.

0:23:34 S2: And that's not the right way. That's not how we should be educating ourselves on this when it's already taken over our body. We need to know ahead of time, so then we are prepared, we can take action, we could have vitamins, we can change our diet, sleep better, we can exercise. Whatever needs to happen, we can be aware of it.

0:23:53.4 S2: Not when it’s prolonged. And I think that's the model of healthcare that we need to get to. We're in a model of sick care, when the symptom arrives, we address the symptom. But we need to get to the point where it's proactive care that we already know, and we studied the woman's body enough to know that this is how it's gonna come. And when it's gonna come, I can be prepared for that. So really, we need to rethink how we think about healthcare, the way we think about it, what that means, how should we be measuring outcomes of reality, and how do we look at it in a holistic fashion, it's physical health, it’s spiritual health, it’s social health, it’s mental health. All of these things for me is healthcare. And then you know what you’re saying is so right, because once you start doing the research to your symptoms, and Facebook is an amazing tool because you have all these groups now and they have followers of a couple of million on the menopause group, I’m in that group because I wanna just hear the comments and the communication that’s going on, so that has really been one of the lifesavers for many, many women around the world, so I think getting onto these groups, getting a message out, is so, so important as a tool.

0:25:05.9 S2: But then related to that is, now that you know you have it and you want to alleviate the symptoms, the healthcare system doesn't… in many countries of the world, menopause is not covered by insurance, including in this part of the world that I’m at. So if you have hot flashes, if you have night sweats, if you don't have any estrogen in your body, you have to pay money out of pocket to get the patches or the gels or the bio-identicals that you need, and it's even in many, many insurance systems in the US and many of the drugs are not covered, or the new… are not covered. The access to, even though you found out everything, you don't have access to it. And that's why I feel that the insurance systems now need to keep pace with the healthcare system of what they're looking at in healthcare, because if they're not covering these basic diseases of life, change of life, it’s not really a disease, it's a change of life, but it has serious implications on our mental and physical and emotional health, which leads to chronic diseases later on, those need to be covered.

0:26:20.1 S1: I even heard about a dry eye syndrome in women when they've gone through menopause and not understanding that there's a correlation, and there is a supplement that was being researched for dry eye in women, and they couldn't get women in the study, and they were only getting men and they ended up that they had so many men, and it wasn't making a difference, so they didn't get the labeling that they wanted to make the claim for dry eye for women in menopause or post-menopause, and so I'm hoping that that they get funding and they can go back in the trial, but that's just an example that I have that's fresh in my mind of, “Oh, I didn't even know that you would get dry eyes”, so maybe that's something that I should even be talking more about and I should interview my mom because my mom could definitely tell me, she was in Toastmasters at the time, she had me at age 40, and then she went through menopause, like 48 to 52, and so I imagine having an eight-year-old and then she had two sons that are in their 20s, she's in this crazy time of life, and you just brought up some things that maybe my mom isn't so crazy that...

0:27:41.0 S1: She just was going through a lot at that time. 

0:27:46 S2: The term pause, it shouldn’t be a pause. It goes on sometimes for…years. Why is it a pause? 

0:27:51 S1: Right. Yeah. 

0:27:53 S2: I question that. Who invented the term?

0:27:59.7 S1: Yes. So why now, the funding and interest in FemTech, Reenita, why is there this rising?

0:28:09.6 S2: I think companies are beginning to understand with this whole focus on gender equity that starts in the workplace, the MeToo movement that happened a couple of years ago, all the presidential debates that went on that we need a woman President, Vice President. You know women have become the center of it all. We are in what we call the Sheconomy, and part of that Sheconomy is that emphasis, that health is very much part of that, and we need to start thinking about it. So companies are waking up to realize that they can't continue to run the system the way we are running it…they can make money out of it, so let's, let’s run it. Most of them are focusing, as I said, on the spring of life, or when we are beautiful, when we’re young, and we were able to procreate. So now we need to move the dial over to the second half of life, the autumn stage.

0:29:11.3 S1: Autumn stage. I like that season. I love autumn, actually. That sounds very nice. I'm thinking that women live five years longer on average than men, that even the end of life, I think there's opportunity there for support of widows, and we're not gonna go into that space right now, but it certainly is something that, when I look at the numbers of how many widows there are that are in nursing homes, and could there be digital health there to help those women? Opportunities there?

0:29:44.4 S2: It's a very interesting part because one of the things that I'm also working on is looking at actual real estate for women. Women only, real estate community homes. Women, there are many more divorced women today than there ever was in the last 10, 20 years, the rates of divorce. Single women, women who are not getting married, it's almost gonna be 45% of the entire working population of women that are gonna be single, and these women are not gonna get married so as they get older, they will have to have some kind of community to be able to live in. So what would that community design look like? How do we create a woman's only kind of community, which is a health, wellness, mind, body and soul space? For these widows as well as we talk about it. So that could be another huge growth opportunity in the future. …Based on needs and we design homes based on all of that. So it's a huge promotion opportunity, I see it in the future, especially when it's gonna be 25% of the population.

0:30:55.5 S1: For the last piece, question that I have, or topic that I have is around the marketing of women's health and the messaging, and you being in Dubai where you're saying there's a lack of messaging and awareness at all, where in the US, it just seems so skewed like a tampon commercial gives you the freedom to feel great and go ride a horse and play beach volleyball is, that's what we see on commercials, when in reality, your first, it stinks to get your period, you don't feel great, so it's not represented accurately I don't think. And I'm curious how, what are you seeing to change that and how can you leave us with an inspiring message to create these campaigns that are relatable and educational and fills with the reality of what it is.

0:31:49.9 S2: I think we're getting more and more authentic campaigning and advertising. In the past is all about selling the dream. That’s why we enjoy looking at this advertising because you know, we could look like that and could be as beautiful as that if we used the product. Or lose 20 pounds in one night or whatever it may be. It was all about selling the dream, and I think for healthcare, yes, selling the dream…but I think we also have to be very realistic, selling that dream, maybe package it in a different way. I think today we're seeing many more women of color on commercials than we’ve ever gotten. We’re seeing more LGBTQ area, we're just beginning to understand them, we don't have any products or solutions around that. I'm starting to look at conferences and events that we can have separate sessions of how do we deal with. We don't even understand the whole aspect of transgender and the effect of hormones on that…So there's so much work that we need to do. So going back to your question on messaging, we need to make it more holistic, we need to make it more mainstream, more representative, so everyone feels included in that and taking real voices.

0:33:08.9 S2: I think that's the best thing, and that's why I love Facebook with the ads on Facebook, because we actually have testimonials of people who have used, their stories, and that's what makes it inspiring when you can see the difference, that you can see the impact.

0:33:21.8 S1: I agree. I'm gonna have to join some more Facebook groups now.

0:33:29.6 S2: Today we're doing a lot of consumer research through Facebook groups, and it's completely unsolicited, it's unadulterated… I think every single FemTech company is collecting data, and they’re following patients. So I think because they’re all female-founded and small, they're being able to do that and collect from the Cloud, how to build that up and get to that stage of actually building and making an impact, that’s gonna take time. But I do, I'm very, very optimistic that we are moving in on a database basis for healthcare, and so far there wasn't anything like that before, and we’re getting actual female data, which we never have. So that is a huge change I see for our daughters maybe. That they won’t have some of the issues we’ve faced, because they will have 20, 30 years of solid data behind that, and this is the first time I think in our entire history that they’re connecting, only women do that, and I think it's fantastic. I think it's a...

0:34:38.7 S1: Makes me think of what we're doing in our nutraceutical line, that maybe we should be going to the menopause space.

0:34:48.9 S2: Lots of opportunity, lots of products as well. On Facebook and find that… I don't know how good they are so that's the other challenge that I have. There's so many nutraceuticals out there, you really don't know what outcomes are you spending so much money out of pocket and buying them, but you don't know, because they're not…or they don't go into any regular process. So we really don't know.

0:35:12.4 S1: I have a low creatine and testosterone in my last, my blood work that I had, and so I'm taking creatine twice a week, but it sure would be nice to have a creatine that was marketed to women and that, both of those happen when you are going into menopause or perimenopause, and they both are low, typically simultaneously so I haven't gotten the testosterone pellets or anything like that yet. I'm still researching all of that, but that could be an area of opportunity for us, all based on the personal need that I'm an entrepreneur that believes if you see a gap or if you use, have a product and you think you could do it better, go out and do it. And it seems that FemTech is the space to do it, and it's such a driver, it helps you get up in the morning. I mean for me, of all the products that I do, it's okay, I can do this better, I'm gonna do it. And I appreciate you and your research of 25 years in this space, Reenita, I hope that when we come out with a product that I can send that to you and I will do you proud with what we’ve put together on our digital and our product, because we just have so much respect for you.

0:36:33.1 S1: So thank you for all of the work that you do for us and further women's health, you're making generational differences in what you're doing.

0:36:40.7 S2: Thank you so much, Patty. Your work is very inspiring and I would love to see what you’re gonna come out with next so I’ll wait with baited breath.

0:36:49.7 S1: You'll be the first for the samples. Yes, great to meet you. Thank you for joining me today on the Persevere Podcast, and make it a great day and yay for FemTech. Let's just keep going. Keep your head down, ladies. 

0:37:03 S1: Thank you for listening to The Persevere Podcast, powered by Checkable Medical. Head over to perseverepodcast.com for notes, links and additional resources from today's show. To continue hearing insights and gaining knowledge from those persevering, succeeding and making their dream a reality, be sure to subscribe through your favorite podcast app. Now go make it happen.